Forget it, it’s “Chinatown”

Tony Maietta:
Hello. I'm film historian, Tony Maietta.

Brad Shreve:
And I'm Brad Shreve, who's just the guy who likes movies.

Tony Maietta:
We discuss movies and television from Hollywood's golden age. We go behind the scenes and share our opinions too.

Brad Shreve:
And of course, being the average guy, my opinions are the ones that matter.

Tony Maietta:
As does your self delusion. Welcome to Going Hollywood.

Brad Shreve:
Tony, I have been recommending that we do Chinatown almost since day 1, and you've never been against it, but we kept getting put off and put off and put off. I'm glad I was persistent.

Tony Maietta:
I did because you know why? Why? Because because I'm scared.

Brad Shreve:
This is a movie to be scared of. Because,

Tony Maietta:
this is the mount we are confronting the mountain here. We are the the ironically, Paramount that made Chinatown. The emblem's the mountain. They used to call Paramount the mountain in the seventies because of the emblem. And, yeah, it is. It is when you said you wanna do Chinatown, after Robert Towne died just recently, I was like, okay. Alright. Let me stretch.

Tony Maietta:
Let me do some some carb loading here because, you know, this mountain we're gonna climb of Chinatown is is daunting. It it's the apex is what it is. That's my my feeling at least. I mean, yeah, maybe Godfather Part 2 is up there as well, but Chinatown is right up there. You know, as the greatest many people say, it's taught in schools, film schools, the greatest screenplay of all time. So it's like, wow. We're gonna take this on. Okay.

Tony Maietta:
Let's do it.

Brad Shreve:
Yeah. Roman Polanski says it's his his greatest work, and it's number, I think, 21 on AFI's 100 films of all time. It should be higher. I mean, it's behind It's a Wonderful Life, and you know how you feel about that.

Tony Maietta:
Yes. Well, AFI.

Brad Shreve:
This movie is just oh, on so many levels. It's just

Tony Maietta:
Well, you know, it's it's the apex. It's it's the greatest. It's the greatest. It's become it's the it's not on the apex of it's the apex of this time in Hollywood too, and I think that's really important to point out. You know, this incredible era that began in, like, with Virginia Woolf and certainly with Bonnie and Clyde, hit it's and went on through, Harold and Maude, and Rosemary's Baby, and The Godfather, Love Story, What's Up Doc? The Last Picture Show, I could go on and on on hit really came to zenith with Chinatown in 1974. So it's a daunting task, but we're gonna take it on because I'm ready to go. I'm pumped for Chinatown, but there's one thing I wanna mention. You know, you're on me all the time about, should we do spoiler alerts? And if we're gonna do a spoiler alert for any movie, it's got to be this one.

Brad Shreve:
Oh, yeah. If you if this movie has been on your list and you haven't watched it, I hate to say this, turn us off, go watch it, but come back because

Tony Maietta:
Yeah.

Brad Shreve:
You don't want anything spoiled from this movie.

Tony Maietta:
For once, I agree with you that they should turn us off and go watch a movie first. Usually, I'm like, no. They can still enjoy it. No. You can't. You have to go watch it because I'm not gonna spoil I'm not gonna spoil this ending for you. I think it's almost, you know, it's kind of like The Usual Suspects or the the the, the Bruce Willis film, the,

Brad Shreve:
The 6th Sense.

Tony Maietta:
The 6th Sense.

Brad Shreve:
Totally like the 6th.

Tony Maietta:
It's that kind of spoiler alert. You know, you have got to watch this movie before you listen to us because we're gonna give it away real soon here, I'm sure, and I'm not gonna take that responsibility on as well as talking about Chinatown to you.

Brad Shreve:
So okay. For those of you still left with us, we're gonna spoil the hell out of this movie.

Tony Maietta:
We're gonna barrel on through. We're gonna barrel on through.

Brad Shreve:
One of the reasons why I love this film is anybody that's read my mysteries. I love LA history, and I love mysteries, and this has it all for me.

Tony Maietta:
Oh, yeah. God. Yeah. And beautiful, beautiful, production values. I mean, I don't wanna we can't get into the production yet. But Richard Silbert, I mean, you know, a mythic mythic production designer created this most beautiful world. And, yes, Roman Polanski and Faye Dunaway and Jack Nicholson at the at their peaks. And, Robert Evans, who pretty much was the wonder kind of Paramount, in the early seventies, who was behind Rosemary's Baby and was behind Love Story and these incredible films and was quite a character.

Tony Maietta:
So I'm excited to talk about Robert Evans, in this. But it's it's just it's this these artists working at their absolute peak. And you know the really sad thing? It was the peak and then it was over. Because what happened the following year? Jaws. And Jaws is the the shark that ate all of Hollywood. Because after Jaws and after this blockbuster mentality that came into being because of Jaws, Suddenly, these store these these films about with story and the Hollywood didn't wanna spend money on investing in story development anymore. They wanted to spend money on marketing, so they could have another Jaws. So the the the tail started wagging the dog at that point, and then of course, Star Wars, and then right up to where we are today where, you know, when you find a film that has this story, a story is dense and complex and satisfying good or bad as Chinatown is, is incredibly rare these days.

Tony Maietta:
They're like gold.

Brad Shreve:
And I agree with you, but I will say at 74, there were some great films, but actually, overall, it was a really bad year for movies. I was looking for through the movies that year, and there were great ones. Blazing Saddles is there. Was Godfather 2 that year?

Tony Maietta:
Godfather part 2. Yeah. It won. It won Chinatown's Oscar.

Brad Shreve:
Young Frankenstein, which I'm not real wild about, but most people absolutely love that film. I think Blazin' Saddle is up near the top of my list.

Tony Maietta:
Sure.

Brad Shreve:
But we also had what was the highest grossing film? Was it, Towering Inferno, for God's sake?

Tony Maietta:
Well, I like Towering Inferno. You don't like Towering Inferno?

Brad Shreve:
Okay. I love to watch Towering Inferno. Absolutely love it. It's a lot of fun, but it is just a cheesy Well disaster film. It's it's not the best film.

Tony Maietta:
Cheesier than the Poseidon Adventure, but okay.

Brad Shreve:
Well, I love the Poseidon Adventure. And this was the same year as Earthquake, and I will say Earthquake was not nearly as good as this movie.

Tony Maietta:
As Chinatown?

Brad Shreve:
Even the special effects on Earth no. No. No. Earthquake was not nearly as good as the Towering Inferno

Tony Maietta:
Yeah. I agree with you.

Brad Shreve:
Because the special effects in the Earthquake were just awful. It was also the year of the trial of Billy Jack. And for t the Billy Jack series, it did not age well in any way, shape, or form.

Tony Maietta:
Well, Billy Jack was actually the movie that brought on the marketing mentality. They poured all of this money, and they opened it incredibly wide, and it made a huge amount of money compared with its budget. And that's what really started the blockbuster mentality, and then Josh just took it to the next level.

Brad Shreve:
This movie was nominated for Oscar. It, was up against Godfather 2, The Conversation, Lenny, and The Tower in Inferno. Mhmm. Did the Godfather 2?

Tony Maietta:
The Godfather 2 won. Yes. It was Yeah. Chinatown was nominated for 11 Oscars, and it won one. Yeah. It One Oscar.

Brad Shreve:
It was nominated for best movie, was nominated for best actor, best actress for Faye Dunaway, best director of Roman Polanski. It only won for best original screenplay. Well deserved.

Tony Maietta:
Well deserved. However, and we're gonna get into this, there are many articles out there now mostly due to Sam Wasson's incredible book, The Big Goodbye, that Robert Townes Oscar may be listed with an asterisk. Oh. Because there he had some help on this screenplay. And here's the thing, and I don't wanna get too much into this now because I wanna talk about it a little bit later. But film filmmaking is a collaborative effort. You know. There are very few screenplays that are written by 1 person by 1 person.

Tony Maietta:
So it's kind of unfair to come after Robert Towne, and say that he really deserved the single Oscar for the screenplay. The point is is that no matter what help he got from Roman Polanski, who Roman Polanski helped him actually Roman Polanski wrote the ending, it was a different ending in Robert Townes' original script. It was still Robert Townes baby. Robert Robert Townes still created it. He still came up with the idea. He is the one who who formed it and brought it to Robert Evans. So he deserves the credit even though he might have gotten some assistance in the writing of it.

Brad Shreve:
Good Will Hunting is well known for being a movie where Matt and Ben get a lot of credit for the writing. It's a great movie, but it changed a lot from their original.

Tony Maietta:
Yeah. Well, all movies do. I mean, when you go through the the history of any movie, you know, and Edward Taylor who is the friend of Robert Towne's that Robert Towne called him his quote, unquote editor. He was a lifelong friend of Robert Towne's and he worked with Robert Towne on all of his screenplays. All of them. So and he didn't he did not want credit for anything. This was on him and his family urged him to get credit. Why aren't you getting credit for this all this work that you're helping to create? And Robert Towne's, you know, reputation in Hollywood is legendary as we just said.

Tony Maietta:
This script is like the Torah. You know, people it's taught in film schools. People come to this screenplay to learn what a great screenplay looks like. So, you know, you have to take that with a grain of salt. It's Robert Towne's script. It's Robert Towne's Oscar, and my god. What an incredible movie he created. Oh, yeah.

Tony Maietta:
You know, it's it's incredible. But here's another thing too. So Roman Polanski was the director. You know, when we look at films, you know, it doesn't it never says, it doesn't say Robert Towne's Chinatown. It doesn't say Robert Evans' Chinatown. It's Roman Polanski's Chinatown. The director is The Final Arbiter.

Brad Shreve:
Yeah.

Tony Maietta:
A film by Roman Polanski. So there's a lot of many films. When we're talking about Postcards on the Edge, we were saying there were scenes that Carrie Fisher didn't like in the movie. And you're like, well, she's a screenwriter, then why did she write them? Well, she didn't. Mike Nichols created them, and Mike Nichols is director and the final arbiter. So you have to remember that. When you're looking at a film and you're looking at screenplay by, you have to remember the director and maybe some other people also had a huge hand in creating this film that you're watching.

Brad Shreve:
And I don't know how true to actual history this movie is, but the movie Saving Mr. Banks, which was about the the making of Mary Poppins.

Tony Maietta:
Right.

Brad Shreve:
And I can't remember the name of the woman that wrote the Mary Poppins series.

Tony Maietta:
P. L. Travers.

Brad Shreve:
Okay. Now in this movie, she is actively involved in the making of this film. And like I said, it may be totally fiction, but it gives you an idea why studios and directors and producers do not want the original writer involved in making a movie in any way.

Tony Maietta:
Yeah. Well, she was a curmudgeon of the nth degree. And, there's a lot of liberties taken with that film, but she really was a real pill to work with. But we're not talking about saving mister Banks. We're talking about Chinatown. And a lot of Chinatown and here's the thing about Chinatown is, and I think that that people I I don't wanna give a big history of I'm more interested in telling the history of the film, not the history behind the film. But, you know, it's it's based on real events that happened in Los Angeles, the the real life water wars that happened because Los Angeles is a desert. I mean, that's the most important thing you have to remember and there ain't a lot of water in a desert.

Tony Maietta:
So all the water that you see in Los Angeles was brought here. You know, just like the people that live here, everybody's transplant here, including the water. So when Los Angeles was being formed in the early 20th century, they realized in order for this town to really grow, they needed water, but where were they gonna get it? I mean, the Los Angeles River is a joke. Yeah. You know, it's always dry except after a very heavy rain. So it doesn't have enough water to sustain a city. So what they did was they looked to the north, and they looked north about 230 miles to the Owens Valley in the Owens River, which had runoff from the Eastern Sierra Nevada Mountains. Well, how do you get water from a place that's 230 miles away? Well, that's where William Mulholland comes in.

Tony Maietta:
Now a lot of people who live in Los Angeles will obviously know the name William Mulholland. And it was William Mulholland's idea to create an aqueduct from the Owens Valley to Los Angeles, 233 miles. And under his leadership, the Los Angeles Aqueduct was built and brought the water from the Owens Valley, winter begins, to the northern reaches of the San Fernando Valley. And it is just a gravity flow water. There is no power behind it. The the power behind it's purely gravity. So there was a syndicate in LA that bought up the land in the San Fernando Valley where the aqueduct ended because it was basically desert land. It was it was it was it was kinda it wasn't worthless, but it wasn't worth much.

Tony Maietta:
So this and this is where Chinatown kinda comes into. There was a syndicate that which bought up this land because I knew it would become very valuable. They had the information of the aqueduct coming down. They knew it would be very valuable and they would make a huge profit once it was irrigated with this water from the Owens Valley. So the back and forth between LA and the Owens Valley became known as the California Water Wars and is really what is the spark plug for Chinatown.

Brad Shreve:
Let me go a little more deep into it because I'm kind of a history buff and I'm actually writing

Tony Maietta:
Oh, so I was just telling you the history, and you're like, no. This is really what happened.

Brad Shreve:
Well, no. We're telling everybody. You know, I'm actually writing a novel about the same time period, a real event that I'm changing a little bit, almost identical to what this film did, though it's nothing to do with the water rates. So this just really attracts me. And Mulholland, is one of the most beautiful drives in LA, the Mulholland Drive is named after this lecherous individual. He and former mayor Fred Eats were actually involved in this whole buyout scandal. And what happened in 1928, as in the movie, is referenced very quickly, the Saint Francis Dam broke and killed 431 people. About a quarter of those were children.

Brad Shreve:
Mullholland took full responsibility, and he died in 1935, disgraced and living in seclusion. So it's really surprising that we still have so many things that are named after him.

Tony Maietta:
Mhmm.

Brad Shreve:
For those that are nowhere near LA, here's an idea. You've heard of the valley, which is the San Fernando Valley. It's on the opposite side of the Hollywood Hills from the rest of LA. The reason why LA is so spread out for a city, the 2nd largest city in the country, our downtown is laughable.

Tony Maietta:
Yeah.

Brad Shreve:
And the reason that is is because of these water rights. LA took the water, and these small towns and and villages that were in the valley were like, LA, you've gotta make us part of LA. They had no other option.

Tony Maietta:
Mhmm.

Brad Shreve:
Annex us so we can survive.

Tony Maietta:
Right.

Brad Shreve:
And that's how LA spread so quickly. That's why there's not really a a central. It's it's like a conglomeration of communities. People see these highways that are jam packed, and they wonder how people in LA deal with this every day. Most of us don't. We we live and work in our own little community. There are some that commute every day, but most don't. So that's how it all got spread out.

Brad Shreve:
I'm probably getting a little weeds, but it's a big deal for me.

Tony Maietta:
Well, no. It's it's fascinating.

Brad Shreve:
I love LA history, and I will say this movie is a love letter to LA.

Tony Maietta:
It is a love letter to the LA of the thirties. Yes. LA of the thirties. And that's one of the things that sparked Robert Towne. You have to understand that the time that Chinatown, the movie was created there, it has 2 there's 2 major driving forces, I think, it's safe to say behind the creation of the film Chinatown. The first one is Watergate, obviously, happened at the same time it was being developed and filmed. Corruption at the highest level is what Chinatown's about. The second one and probably the most important one were the Manson murders.

Tony Maietta:
Because in 1969, when Charles Manson's family bludgeoned Roman Polanski's wife, his pregnant wife, Sharon Tate to death, this entire and and and 5 of her friends, this entire town went into lockdown. The paranoia covered the town because there was no rhyme or reason to this to this senseless heinous act, this this butchery that happened. So this entire town went into and a real sense of paranoia came over the town. By the way, they were all connected to Sharon Tate in some way or another. We just talked about Roman Polanski, Sharon Tate's husband. Robert Evans knew Sharon Tate because he was very close with Roman Polanski. They had done Rosemary's Baby together. Jack Nicholson was supposed to be in the film The Day of the Dolphin with Sharon Tate that was going to be directed by Robin Polanski.

Tony Maietta:
It later ended up being directed by Mike Nichols. Robert Towne's wife had had dinner with Sharon Tate right before the murder. So there's this all connected. So the there's no way to overstate how the effect that the Manson murders had on Hollywood and what it did to people. And Robert Towne grew up. He's a Los he was a Los Angeles native. He grew up in LA, and he was remembering the times of his childhood. The nostalgia was having a real nostalgic trip for his life as a child in the thirties and forties, which is where Chinatown the idea for Chinatown came from in his mind.

Tony Maietta:
He said there were 2 sources. One of them was this article that was called Raymond Chandler's LA and it was basically a photoshoot that was a contemporary photoshoot, but was done in the style of a Raymond Chandler novel detective story. And he realized that you could still find parts of Raymond Chandler's LA in his modern day LA, and that gave him the idea of doing And the second one And the second one was Carrie McWilliams' book, Southern California Country, an Island on the Land, which is basically the history of of Southern California. And, in a letter to McWilliamstown said that Southern California country really changed his life because it taught him to look at the place where he was born, and it convinced him to write about it. Thus, Chinatown.

Brad Shreve:
And what's funny, I kept having to remind myself this was not written by Raymond Chandler. Yeah. I knew better, but it is so Chandler esque. It's so Philip Marlowe.

Tony Maietta:
Oh, very much so.

Brad Shreve:
Oh, it's just You know,

Tony Maietta:
and he was he was good friends with Jack Nicholson. He'd known Jack Nicholson for they were best friends. He went to acting classes with Jack Nicholson in the fifties, and he by this time, Jack Nicholson had done 5 easy pieces and was a big star. And he said, I wanna write a detective story for Jack. That's how that started, but it's really hard to overstate the effect that, the Manson murders had on Chinatown. Because what is what is Chinatown about the theme of Chinatown? Because it's there's one scene that takes place in Chinatown. So when people would ask Robert Towne, what is Chinatown? He would always say, Chinatown is a state of mind. It's a metaphor for the futility of good intentions.

Tony Maietta:
It's the inevitability of defeat. So, basically, you're trying to help someone and in helping them, you're actually doing the reverse. And that's what happens in this film to Jack Nicholson's character, JJ Giddys.

Brad Shreve:
And in the original script, there was no Chinatown scene in the movie. Right. So this has nothing really to do with Chinatown other than what Tony said and Jack Nicholson's character had bad memories of what happened there. But really, that's the only reason. I'm people will probably scratch their heads and wonder why why is this called Chinatown? That's that's the reason.

Tony Maietta:
Yeah. And that's that's part of the reason why this people have a lot of difficulty under understanding this script. Many people said to him, Robert Evans said to him, well, where's Chinatown in this? The movie is called Chinatown, and Robert Towne tried to explain to Robert Evans that it's it's exactly it. It's a state of mind. So they did end up putting that final scene in Chinatown, because Chinatown represents, as we just said, the futility of good intentions. And Jack Nicholson's character, JJ Giddey's, did have an experience in Chinatown where he thought he was helping someone, and he ended up doing the exact opposite and it haunts him. And what happens? It happens again in this movie. And did you know how he got how he, came up with the idea of Chinatown, his his his talk to the the vice cop in Chinatown? No.

Tony Maietta:
Robert Towne? Nope. He he was he was buying a dog, basically. This was after the Manson murders and he was thinking we should probably at least have a dog. And he went to buy it, this the breeder ended up being a vice cop in LA. And he was talking to him. He said, what do you do? And he goes, oh, I'm a vice cop. Oh, where do you work? I work in Chinatown. And he said, what do you do in Chinatown? And he said, as little as possible.

Tony Maietta:
And that struck Robert Towne and he was like, why? What what does that mean? And he said, the vice cop said to him, you can't get inside the culture in Chinatown. With all the different tongs and languages, you can't tell whether or not you're preventing a crime or your interference is actually helping someone commit a crime. And it's that kind of spider's web, illusionary area in your mind where you're not really sure what is going on. That's Chinatown. Chinatown is this place where you're not really sure. It's like a hall of mirrors. You're not really sure what's happening, what's going on, and the best thing to do, and this line is in the movie, is as little as possible.

Brad Shreve:
So should I give a rundown of the film? Very brief.

Tony Maietta:
Yeah. I want you to because I'm not gonna attempt it, so you go ahead.

Brad Shreve:
Okay. This is a 1974 rom com.

Tony Maietta:
With Ryan O'Neil and Bartman.

Brad Shreve:
No. It's a 1974 mystery suspense, directed by Roman Polanski, as we said, starring Jack Nicholson, Faye Dunaway, and John Houston. I'm gonna set the tone for this film. In the film, Jack Nicholson's character is asked, are you alone? And his response is, isn't everybody? And that is the tone of this film because it's it's not this is a very uncomfortable film. It's a beautiful film, but it's uncomfortable.

Tony Maietta:
Gorgeous, gorgeous film.

Brad Shreve:
The story takes place in 1937 Los Angeles, which is about 10 years after the events that Tony and I just talked about. Jack Nicholson is Jake Giddis, a PI who specializes in cheating spouse cases. He is hired by the wife, air quotes, of Hollis Mulray because she thinks he is cheating on her. Well, Mulray winds up dead, and surprise, surprise, it wasn't Mulry's wife that hired him. It was, that's actually part of the mystery. Who was this person that hired him? And it was not his real wife who was played by Faye Dunaway. As we said, it's loosely based on this whole, the water rights issue. So the question really throughout the film is was Mul Ray murdered because of his personal life? Was he murdered because of his professional life? Was it a mix of both? There are so many twists and turns and surprises in this film.

Tony Maietta:
Yes. It's an onion. It's a it's a big dirty evil onion. And Jake Giddies, he pulls away one layer after another after another, and it it just gets more and more and more complicated the more he finds out. He thinks he knows it, and actually, you know, we'll we'll definitely talk about John Houston. But John Houston's character says to him point blank, you don't know what you're dealing with. And this is this is J. J.

Tony Maietta:
Getty's this is Jack Nicholson's tragic flaw, his hubris. He thinks he's smarter than everybody. He's a wonderful character, by the way. He's a very appealing character. Jack Nicholson has never been more appealing, in my opinion. I think he's very he's very handsome in this film. He dresses. He's a pop and jay, as they say.

Tony Maietta:
He likes to look good, just like Jack Nicholson. He's a very appealing character, but he he thinks he knows what's going on. He thinks he knows better than everybody, and he's gonna be a big hero in the end. And as it turns out, he's always one step behind. And his hubris and thinking he can become the big hero is what eventually causes the tragedy at the very end of the film, and that is the very essence and the very definition of Chinatown that we just said, the futility of good intentions. You think you're doing something to help someone, and you actually end up doing the exact opposite.

Brad Shreve:
To speak on John Huston, I gotta say, when it comes to movie villains and evil, you know, you have, Hannibal Lecter. You have Norman Bates. You have Darth Vader. You have Freddy Krueger. You have Jason. These are all villains, good and bad, well done. What makes his character so terrifying and so horrible is he's real. Yeah.

Brad Shreve:
You can you believe this is a real person. So he's far more to me, far more terrifying than the others I just mentioned.

Tony Maietta:
Well, he's a sociopath. And he believes he's above the law, but he doesn't come off that way. You know, he doesn't appear that way. He's the ultimate evil because he doesn't appear evil. On the surface, he appears to be a pleasant jovial, you know, multi billionaire who's just trying to do his best in life, and he's not. He ends up being the ultimate evil. So, yeah, he is the ultimate he is the ultimate, and you don't realize he's the ultimate villain until the very end of the film, which is what's so devastating and what he's done to his daughter, Faye Dunaway, Evelyn Mulray, is not revealed until the end, and it's, you know, it's the big secret of Chinatown. It's the big spoiler alert of Chinatown.

Tony Maietta:
So we have this we have this mystery going on about water and all this government corruption when you realize that no. The real story here, the real tragedy tragedy underneath is this family crime that has been committed.

Brad Shreve:
Great diversion.

Tony Maietta:
It's a great diversion, but you realize that's so that's when when when his character says to JJ Giddey, you have no idea what you're getting involved with. He means it. He does have no idea. And when he finds it out at the end, it's all it's stunning.

Brad Shreve:
And John Hughes' character, I have said many, many, many times that Satan will not show up with a pointy tail and a fish pitchfork. No. And this fits that scenario, because he seems like a kindly old rich man. He does. Good kind of a good old boy, actually.

Tony Maietta:
Yeah. Well, he's a very charming, very, you know, easygoing. On the surface, he appears to be this pleasant jovial guy, and he's anything but when you find out what he's done. You know, there's so many things about this movie which are originally, Robert Towne was going to call, John Houston's character Julian Cross for JC. You know? You know who the the ultimate JC is? Because this because this film has these kind of incredible biblical allusions and that just but he changed the name to Noah because Noah who's the most famous Noah of all? The Noah that was involved in that flood. So, I mean, it's it's incredible the the the layers in Chinatown and the allusions to these things, which make it even more than just a story because you have these biblical references to this character who is the ultimate the ultimate evil.

Brad Shreve:
Tony, I'm stopping our conversation real quick.

Tony Maietta:
Why? Why, Brad? We're we're in the middle of a podcast.

Brad Shreve:
But this is about the podcast, and it's very important.

Tony Maietta:
Okay.

Brad Shreve:
Listener, whatever app you're listening on, whether it's on the computer or on the phone, reach your finger or your mouse over. It usually says follow, some still say subscribe, and click that. And what's gonna happen when they do that, Tony?

Tony Maietta:
They're gonna get notified when a new episode is available, and they can listen to us again. You know, I don't wanna miss that. No. Can we get back to the episode that we were recording?

Brad Shreve:
Of course. Please? Of course.

Tony Maietta:
Alright. Thank you. Don't forget to subscribe and follow. There you go. So So we talked a little about Jack Nicholson's character, JJ Gittis. He was a who's a private detective as Jack as Brad said, in Los Angeles. He used to be a cop, he used to be a cop and he worked in Chinatown. That's part of his history and as I said to you earlier, you know, something happened in Chinatown.

Tony Maietta:
We don't really find out exactly what happened, but we find out that it was exactly that exactly that. The good intentions, you know, his the it's the tragedy of good intentions, the futility of good intentions.

Brad Shreve:
And the details are unnecessary, and I'm glad they didn't go into the details. They told us just enough we need to know.

Tony Maietta:
Yeah. Exactly. We so he has a history with Chinatown. And so the thing about JJ Giddey's is is, first of all, his name the name JJ Giddey's is inspired by Jack Nicholson. Jack Nicholson's first name is John Joseph Nicholson. So there's your JJ. And the the Giddys is from a producer friend of his named Harold Giddys. So they thought that was a really great name for, a a character.

Tony Maietta:
It's just JJ Giddey's. And John Houston's character always calls him Gitz. He doesn't say giddies. And that's a clue right there that John Houston's character does what he wants. He does not care, but that's a real just a minor little point that you get if you have to watch it and you have to see that. Faye Dunaway plays Evelyn Mulray. Evelyn Mulray at first glance is your typical film noir Femme Fatale from her very first appearance and she's gorgeous. Godfrey Donnelly is beautiful in this film.

Tony Maietta:
Just gorgeous.

Brad Shreve:
She's striking striking is a good word.

Tony Maietta:
She yeah. She's striking. She's she's she's like Dietrich in this film. I mean, that's she's so beautiful in this movie. And what's wonderful about this is, you know, she makes her first appearance and you think she's, you know, the classic trope from film noir, the femme fatales. Well, femme fatales in these movies usually are the ones who take everybody in. They think they're innocent and good, and at the end, they end up being the cause of destruction. It's just the reverse.

Tony Maietta:
So town takes that classic film noir trope of the femme fatale and turns on his head. Because you think she's not she's no good. You think maybe she murdered her husband, and you find out that she's the only innocent one in all this. She's the one who's the victim of this. And that's another astounding thing that that is in this film that that Tom put in this film. Another surprise that you don't expect. And, boy, does it knock you on your ass?

Brad Shreve:
Yeah. It's like, oh my god. And I had forgotten. I all I remembered is how much I love this movie. And because, you know, I've told you before. I remember if I loved them or hated them, but I don't remember the details, which is kinda nice when I watch them again.

Tony Maietta:
Yeah. It's kind of like you can see it you can see it for the first time.

Brad Shreve:
Yeah. And I was just disgusted. I was just as disgusted as the first time.

Tony Maietta:
Did you actually forget the twist? Yes. You did? Oh my god. How can you possibly forget that?

Brad Shreve:
Well, you know, I was on vacation last week. Yes. So I watched it with my sister and my brother. My sister was asleep in 5 minutes, but it had nothing to do with the film. But my brother kept when I kept bringing up the film during the week, he kept saying, you know, it's a good movie. I I kinda remember. I don't think it was as great as everybody said. He was so engrossed in this film.

Brad Shreve:
He just was on the edge of the seat. But when it ended with its very dark ending, he said, this is why I remember I didn't like the film.

Tony Maietta:
Alright with the ending. Well, yeah. Well, that's that was a bone of contention because in the original script, the ending was different. That's Roman Polanski's ending. Roman Polanski Robert Towne actually left the production because he was fighting with Roman Polanski so much about the ending. In the original ending of Robert Towne's script, Evelyn Mulray kills her father, her daughter, here's the spoiler, also her sister get is is safe, and she goes to prison, but you feel like evil has been taken care of. That doesn't happen in the movie. Okay.

Tony Maietta:
Roman Polanski, you gotta come out from Roman Polanski. This was a guy who knew horror, and I mean, in his life. He also knew horror in Rosemary's baby, but he knew horror. He knew tragedy. He was a child of the holocaust. His mother was killed in the holocaust. And by the way, she was pregnant when she was killed.

Brad Shreve:
Oh, dear.

Tony Maietta:
His wife, Sharon Tate, was butchered, and she was also pregnant when she was butchered to death.

Brad Shreve:
And I'm thinking of Rosemary's baby now.

Tony Maietta:
Yeah. Well, this is a man who knew evil. So and what Roman Polanski said was no. No. In order for people to think when they're you want people to think when they leave a movie, you give them an ending that they don't like and they don't expect. Roman Polanski knew that despite your best intention, despite how many times you pick yourself up and dust your start self off and start all over again, life can kick you in the balls and evil can triumph. And that's why this ending of Chinatown, the Chinatown ending that we see now of Evelyn being killed and her daughter slash sister being in now in the care of the man who raped her when she was 15 years old. That's why the very end when Grandfather slash father.

Brad Shreve:
Oh,

Tony Maietta:
yes. That's why the very end when when Jack Nicholson is standing there in utter disbelief of what's happened, the very famous final line, forget it, Jake. It's Chinatown. Because that's what happens in Chinatown. Chinatown is the metaphor for the futility of good intentions. JJ Gideast thought he was doing something great. He was gonna be the big hero, but he didn't know what he was dealing with. And in the end, he allowed or he facilitated the triumph of evil.

Brad Shreve:
In an interview, Polanski said regarding the ending of this movie ending so unhappily. He said, without that, we wouldn't be sitting around talking about it.

Tony Maietta:
Yes. Exactly. Well, that's what I meant when he said, if you want an audience to leave a theater talking about your movie, you give them an ending, which is not what they expected, not what they wanted. Everybody wants evil to be taken care of. But Roman Polanski knew. He dealt with it in his childhood. He dealt with with the murder of his wife. That evil prevails, and evil is all over.

Tony Maietta:
That's what so, oh, I don't know first of all how you could forget the twist in Chinatown. That surprises that really surprises me because here's the as as I just said, Evelyn Mulray, who we think is the femme fatale is not. She is the daughter of Noah Cross who raped her when she was 15 years old, got her pregnant, and she has a child. So one of the one of the red herrings in Chinatown, when JJ Giddey's is first hired by the fake Evelyn Mulray, who's a fabulous Diane Ladd. She's an actress who's who's been hired to impersonate Evelyn Lorraine. So when Jake's hired by her, she says it's because he's cheating and he she wants photos cause that's what he does. That's what JJ Giddey's does. He's the detective who who follows cheating husbands and cheating wife.

Tony Maietta:
And so he and so Hollis Mulray, Evelyn's husband is seen with this young girl and everybody assumes, we the audience assume, when the first time we watch Chinatown, that this is the chippy that he is, you know, cheating on his wife with. Well, it turns out Evelyn Mulray was not the right Evelyn Mulray. She was an actress who was hired to impersonate her, and that Chippy was not his girlfriend, it was his stepdaughter who's also his step niece. Is that right? Is that is that is that how that went? Yeah.

Brad Shreve:
I guess so. Or boy. It's hard to say.

Tony Maietta:
Sister sister daughter. Yes. Who's no. Who's also his sister-in-law. His stepdaughter is also his sister-in-law, my sister, my daughter, my sister, my daughter.

Brad Shreve:
Yeah.

Tony Maietta:
In the famous scene where Jack Nicholson is slapping Faye Dunaway around, and you've seen it on you've seen it parody a 1000000 times. I think it was paired on Will and Grace one time, where he's trying to find out who is this girl that you're protecting? Who is this girl? And she had previously, Faye Dunaway had told him that that that she was her sister, and then he found out she didn't have a sister. She goes, well, she's my daughter. And he says, you don't have a daughter, and he slaps her. She goes, she's my sister, slap. My daughter, slap. Sister, slap. Daughter.

Tony Maietta:
She's my sister and my daughter, and that's the moment of horror in Chinatown when you realize, oh it was.

Brad Shreve:
He should have won an Oscar from the look on his face when she said that, and he realized what

Tony Maietta:
Oh my god. Yeah. Oh my god. Yeah. And how about Faye Dunaway? You know, Faye Dunaway gets a lot of grief. We all know this. There's a really good documentary about her on HBO right now.

Tony Maietta:
I recommend it. Because, yeah, she's a little crazy, but she's also a brilliant actress. And here's the thing, say what you want to about Faye Dunaway. And yes, a lot of people don't like her. She was very difficult to work with. She had her battles with Roman Polanski, but Jack Nicholson wanted to turn in this film because she's perfect in the film, and she said to Jack before that scene, Jack you just have to hit me. There's no faking this, this is too important. So here's an actress who kinda like Vivian Lee in Streetcar Named Desire who would crawl on broken glass to get a performance right, kind of Faye Dunaway.

Tony Maietta:
Of course, Faye Dunaway would have everybody else crawl on the broken glass with her to get it right, but she was very committed to making this film work and making this character work. So much so that Jack Nicholson was really slugging her, and you can see it. I mean, she is shaken at the end of that movie, but, God, what a scene. What you you had to have it that way.

Brad Shreve:
Yeah. I've heard he felt guilty doing that because she'd insisted they do so.

Tony Maietta:
Right. But they were friends. You know, they used to hang out. And it's funny there are a lot of the a lot of the people who were considered Jane Fonda was Evan's first choice was Jane Fonda. But Jane Fonda, like so many people this script was brought to, didn't understand it. She didn't understand the story. So Jane Fonda passed, but Polanski always wanted Faye Dunaway, Nicholson always wanted Faye Dunaway, and God, she's perfect in this. You have you feel for that character so much.

Tony Maietta:
You she gives you such sympathy. You know, I don't know that there's ever been of, another Faye Dunaway performance where you felt such sympathy and sorrow for one of her characters.

Brad Shreve:
You feel sympathy, but, really, this is one reason I think also people don't like Faye Dunaway is she's also very unlikable through most of the film. And she's the same way in Network. She she's just a very harsh

Tony Maietta:
Oh, I totally disagree.

Brad Shreve:
And, you know, both of these movies are both of these movies are 2 of my top films, and I I don't like her through most of both.

Tony Maietta:
I totally disagree with you.

Brad Shreve:
You do?

Tony Maietta:
She is nothing. She is nothing like this as she is a network. In Network, she is a she's basically no no cross in Network. She's the evil one in Network.

Brad Shreve:
Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You have such oh, I'm not saying it's the same character at all. No.

Tony Maietta:
No. I don't see. I don't find her anyway. I find her so touching. In the beginning of this movie, she's very cold and very distant. And yes, you see, you know, she goes, I don't get tough with people, my lawyer does. So she's playing that femme fatale. But as the movie goes on and you learn more about her and you see her vulnerabilities and you see this is a woman who is very shaken.

Tony Maietta:
She can never say father. She always hesitates before she says my father or or she stumbles over the word and, you know, that was a choice of Faye Dunaway's and drove Roman Polanski a little crazy, because apparently, they had to go through tons and tons of of footage to find a decent my father take from Faye Dunaway, but she got it. She you have such sympathy for her that the moment when, she has the love scene with Jack Nicholson and they kiss and she's in bed with him, In my opinion, she's so soft. She's so she's so loving. You you see this woman who's been hurt. You see this victim, even though you don't know what causes this hurt, and you find out later, you know, the most horrific act of all, I find her so incredibly sympathetic. So when in the end when she's shot, it's just it's devastating. It's devastating.

Brad Shreve:
It is devastating. Part of it is her persona, but I I agree she's a very sympathetic character. But every time you start to feel sympathy, again, they give us a distraction. You know, there's so many great deceptions that make because you start to like her. You start to soften to her and then get us looks in the window of the home. And you don't know it's her daughter at the time, but you see this distressed woman on the bed. And then it looks like she's evil again, and it goes back and forth and back and forth. They they're so good at that.

Brad Shreve:
You know, the very first twist is really after he's hired, and he's following Mulray around. And Mulray is just walking all over the place, walking around the, you know, the dry riverbeds and down by the ocean, and you realize this guy isn't having an affair. And then the next thing you know, he's in this boat with this young woman and you're like, oh, wait a minute. He is having an affair.

Tony Maietta:
Yeah. Well, it's

Brad Shreve:
Again, another distraction.

Tony Maietta:
Well, that's that's Chinatown. That's of the illusion of Chinatown, you know. That's that's what makes this screenplay so brilliant is is that you just go down all these roads that you didn't expect to go down and leads to another road, and another road, and another road. It's a maze until you, you know, you you just get lost in all the duplicity, in all of the lies, and all of the cover ups, and that's why a lot of people, you know, didn't understand this film when it was presented to them, because it's a very complex, and you really have to think about, okay, what is going on here? And, you know, when you find out that Evelyn has been raped by her father and this is her daughter and her sister and you realize, oh, my god, you know, this is the ultimate evil that has that has landed on this poor woman, and then in the end, she gets killed in evil triumphs. It's devastating. It's it's one of those movies where you sit there and you just sit there for, like, 10 minutes afterwards and going, what did I just see? What just happened? It's incredible.

Brad Shreve:
I was so repulsive in this movie, sitting there watching. First of all, Faye Dunaway murdered, well, killed by the cops and, you know, lying on her steering wheel. Her daughter is then screaming, pulled out of the car by her grandfather who she was born from from incestuous rape, and now he has custody of her. Yeah. It was so disgusting. And I gotta say, I hated this film because of its depressing ending, and I loved this film because of its depressing ending. And the reason is I, you know, I don't wanna reflect back on my own writing because I'm I wish I could write like this. But one thing I tell my readers all the time is I will never promise you a happy ending.

Brad Shreve:
The only guarantee I will give you is the crime will be solved. Beyond that, I will not give because I I don't want you to know. I I wanna keep you guessing. You never know if it's gonna be a happy ending or a sad ending, and that's what I loved about this. I'm so tired of Hollywood always thinking they have to give us happy ending. It surprised me.

Tony Maietta:
That was kind of Robin Polanski's point. You know? It was it was like, no. This there's only one from a man who knew evil personally, who had evil visited upon him many times, and whatever you think of Roman Polanski and what happened later in his life, that's what what we're no. We're not talking about that.

Brad Shreve:
Yeah. I don't wanna go there.

Tony Maietta:
I'm talking about Roman Polanski in 1974 and what he had dealt with in his life. He knew evil. So, I mean, in so many ways, he was the perfect person to direct this film, you know, and he's the and that ending is, when you think about it, Robert Towne wanted a happier ending, not a happy ending, but a happier ending at least where, you know, Noah Cross is killed, and now we have an ending where, the victim is killed. Hello. Chinatown. You know? It you really do think about it. It really makes you think about this film over and over again.

Tony Maietta:
And and what did I just see? And and it's just the futility of life at times sometimes. It's it's stunning.

Brad Shreve:
Now I'm gonna shock you here as I'm gonna shock probably many people. I have never been a fan of Jack Nicholson. In fact, I've always told people I hate Jack Nicholson. And there's a reason for that. I, I didn't like oh, what was the movie where where the women were,

Tony Maietta:
the Witches of Eastwick.

Brad Shreve:
The Witches of Eastwick. I hated that film. I didn't like him in as good as it gets, so he did play the character well. There's other movies I didn't like him in, and so I always had in my head that I don't like Jack Nicholson. And I'm not a I'm not a huge fan of easy writer. I I it's a good film, but I think it's underrated. But then I think back to this film, and I think back to One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest and some of the other ones that he's been in. And I realized, no.

Brad Shreve:
He's I like him. I just didn't like those particular roles, and they're the ones that, for whatever reason, stuck with me. This guy is amazing. And I've never understood the attraction of Jack Nicholson, but, boy, this movie, wow, he looked great. He looked Yeah.

Tony Maietta:
He did. In I think what you're saying is is that you don't like the caricature of Jack Nicholson. Yes. I mean, you know,

Brad Shreve:
That's it exactly

Tony Maietta:
It's what he what he became, the Shining Jack Nicholson. That kind of that kind of well, we know. We know what the character Jack Nicholson is.

Brad Shreve:
And, yeah, The Shining is one of my most hated films.

Tony Maietta:
It's it's the caricature. I'm in there

Brad Shreve:
Stephen King doesn't like it either, the the original version. I also think of one movie that he absolutely loved him in As Good as it Gets.

Tony Maietta:
He became such a caricature, and he perpetuated that character. After

Brad Shreve:
You are a 100%.

Tony Maietta:
After Chinatown, he did One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest. In fact, there's a funny story about during the Oscars, during the Academy Awards that Chinatown was nominated for the 70 4 Academy Award. When they announced the best actor and it went to Art Carney and everybody for Harry and Tonto. And everybody was, like, what? I mean, you had Al Pacino, you had Jack Nicholson nominated, went to Art Carney for Harry and Tonto. And Jack, someone, you know, went up leaned up to comfort Jack, and Jack said, don't worry about it. You know, I'll get it for Cuckoo's Nest. I can't do Jack Nicholson, so I'm not gonna try. He had just filmed one flew over the Cuckoo's Nest.

Tony Maietta:
So he he knew he would get it for Cuckoo's Nest and he did. And then after Cuckoo's Nest, he kind of lost motivation. You know, he did this incredible string of films, The Last Detail, Chinatown, 5 Easy Pieces, and One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest being kind of like the Apex, he gets the Oscar. And then he started doing these kind of yeah. You're witches of Eastwick. You're things where he was a caricature. I love him in terms of endearment, but he's a supporting character in terms of endearment. I like him as good as it gets as well.

Tony Maietta:
So there were glimpses of the old Jack Nicholson, but this was really him in his prime era. And like you, I never thought of myself as a Jack Nicholson fan, but I love him in this. I think he is so charming. He's such he's so his character is so engrossing. And, you know, the there's also the scene where his this is an interesting thing. So this was really his first film as a romantic leading man. Now you look at Jack Nicholson, you don't think of him that way, but people do, as you just pointed out. A lot of people think of him as a people love him.

Tony Maietta:
People love him. And so his his first film was a romantic leading man, and he spends over half of it with a big bandage on his nose because his nose has been slit by Roman Polanski as it turns out. That part was played. The thug was Roman Polanski. So he gets his nose slit because that's what happens to nosey You know what happens to nosey guys? They lose their noses. And so he spends half of the movie in this in this romantic film with a big bandage over his nose, and it's actually a very funny scene. But there's so many interesting things about this little tidbits about this about this film that I would just like to point out a couple of them. So at the time, speaking of Jack Nicholson in romantic, you know, he was dating Angelica Houston for years.

Tony Maietta:
He and and, Angelica Houston were involved in a relationship for years. And, of course, Angelica Houston is the daughter of John Houston. So Angelica Houston was on the set the day they were filming the first encounter between Noah Cross and JJ Giddey's. And Noah Cross has a has a line to JJ where he says you're sleeping with my daughter. So it's kind of meta. It's kind of a meta moment in in that film, which I think is really is really kinda funny.

Brad Shreve:
What I think really shows the talent of Jack Nicholson in this movie, Jake has so many great lines. He puts people down in such beautiful ways. His insults are just incredible. And it could have sounded kinda sticky in the wrong actor. And he does it. It's so natural. And Jake is so like he is so likable and so kind, and he's so violent and so brutal. Mhmm.

Brad Shreve:
All and it all seems very natural. You know this guy. And you kinda like this guy and sometimes you think I shouldn't like this.

Tony Maietta:
You kinda you kinda you wanna you like this guy. You do and you want him to be triumphant, but what's his problem? That tragic flaw. Yeah. You know, in classical drama, there's the hero with a with a tragic flaw. And his tragic flaw is his hubris. He thinks he knows more than he does. And he doesn't listen to people when they tell him to forget it, Jake. It's Chinatown.

Tony Maietta:
He doesn't. He try he wants to be the big hero, and that's his ultimate downfall, and he pays the ultimate price when the woman that he's falling in love with is murdered because of him. Because he told her to come to Chinatown. So it's it's really it's so wonderful. What I love about this film is too, as you said, some of his lines could be really hokey, but here's what here's what's brilliant about this film is is that it is a noir. It's a it's a a film noir. Mhmm. So it's it's but what what they wanted to do when they wanted to make this detective film Valentine to Los Angeles was film it very much in that style, but do the things you couldn't get away with in 19 forties detective stories that you could get away with in 9 in 1974.

Tony Maietta:
Obviously, there's not gonna be any incest in a 1944 detective story. So what's great about Chinatown is is that you're watching you're kind of watching this old film noir, but it's modern film noir. The colors are gorgeous. He uses these wide anamorphic lenses, which keeps everything in focus in the when they want it to be in focus. So you can see stuff going on in the background which is very important and you should pay attention to it, but also if you can see what's going on in the foregrounds and that's fabulous. The production design as I said before Richard Silbert, one of the greatest production designers ever. He direct he designed Virginia Woolf, The Graduate, Rosemary's Baby. This is all this Paramount crew under Robert Evans.

Tony Maietta:
I wanna talk a little bit about Robert Evans. Okay. Do you know much about Robert Evans?

Brad Shreve:
No. I know very little. Educate me and

Tony Maietta:
I find him such a fascinating character. He is one of those. He's a throwback to the old movie guys. He's a throwback to the Jack Warner's who were flashy and, you know, talked big, but believed in movies. They ate, slept, and breathed movies, and that was Robert Evans. He was. He was a really you know, he wore the wide lapels. You can almost smell the aqua velvet when you see Robert Evans.

Tony Maietta:
I mean, he's kind of a seventies player, you know, married to Allan McGraw, but he was he loved movies so much, and he was the head of production at Paramount. They created these incredible run of films that we just talked about. And Chinatown was his first production, not only as head of the studio, but as a producer. He produced, he personally produced Chinatown. Now, this happens sometimes in the golden era with, Jack Warner personally produced a couple films and so did Daryl Zanuck, but this didn't happen in Hollywood and this pissed a lot of people off because it's kind of like, what's it called? It's kind of like a conflict of interest when you have the studio chief who's also a producer. Well, what movies get what movie do you think is gonna get all the attention? The movie that you're personally producing is gonna get it. So this pisses a lot of people off. So he had to leave Paramount after this.

Tony Maietta:
And he did some independent films that were success, but he had a real downfall, a real tragic downfall. And I think if you get a chance to, there's a great documentary on Robert Evans called The Kid Stays in the Picture. It talks all about his career first as an actor discovered by Norma Shearer at the pool of the Beverly Hills Hotel Through this whole great run of films he had, through Love Story, through The Godfather saga, he developed all these. He nurtured all of these. And now he's kind of thought of as a joke. And I think that's unfortunate because what a great filmmaker. He's responsible for these films. He's responsible for this film for sure, and I think he needs to be better known.

Brad Shreve:
I'm looking at his filmography while you're talking. If you look at it, it's so hit or miss. You have this film. You have Marathon Man, which is a brilliant film. You have Black Sunday, which sucked. You have Urban Cowboy, great film. Then you have The Two Jakes, which is a sequel to this one. It sucked.

Brad Shreve:
You also have, Popeye, which is one of the worst movies ever made. He he's just like like Yes. Find your place here because he he's a

Tony Maietta:
Well, Chinatown was his zenith. But look at the movies before look at the movies before Chinatown. Look at Rosemary's baby. Look at Harold Mott. Look at, The Godfather, both of them. Look at Love Story. These were we're talking about the films up to Chinatown. And then after Chinatown, like so many of these people, same thing with Roman Polanski.

Tony Maietta:
I mean Roman Polanski had personal issues which happened, but a lot of and a lot of these people really hit their peak with Chinatown or soon after. Now Faye Dunaway obviously went on to network and won her Oscar, and then she had her downfall. But I what I'm trying to say about Robert Evans is is that he doesn't he gets so much attention now for being this kind of a caricature, seventies producer. As I said, you can smell the aquavelva. But he as I said, he he ate, breathed, and slept movies, and we don't have that anymore. We do not have that anymore. That kind of romantic sense of Hollywood is gone.

Brad Shreve:
The Hollywood that you loved and moved out here for.

Tony Maietta:
Yeah. I love this Hollywood. This Hollywood, I've I would I was alive during this Hollywood. I don't. I had no knowledge of it, but, you know, this would this is a fabulous because these people were just like those people back in the Hollywood I love, back in classic Hollywood. They movies were in their blood and they were so passionate about them and that's what makes this film so Who could can you imagine somebody pitching this movie today? Can you imagine Robert Towne going to a producer and going, yeah. So, anyway, it's about the water in Los Angeles and who owns it and who doesn't. And, oh, by the way, there's an ancestral relationship between a father and his daughter, and they all end up and she ends up dead in the end.

Tony Maietta:
I mean, who's gonna buy that? No. Robert Evans did. Even though he didn't understand it, like all these other people, he bought it. Incredible.

Brad Shreve:
Film is a business, but it there was this era when film was both a business and an art. And it seems like that art has pulled away, and now it's just business.

Tony Maietta:
Mhmm. Yeah. Well, this was this was the end of it. This was the, you know, this was the end of a certain Hollywood which existed for a very brief amount of time and then was over. You know, Robert Towne originally envisioned this as a trilogy, as you just said briefly. He actually wanted the second film in this trilogy. The second film is called the 2 Jakes, which, Brad just mentioned. He originally had the idea for the 2 Jakes.

Tony Maietta:
Robert Evans wanted to produce the 2 Jakes, like, shortly after Chinatown, but it didn't come together. Robert Towne wanted to direct it, that fell through, it went through turn around hell. It was finally made in 1990, and it was not a success. So the third, part of the story was going to be called Giddis versus Giddis, and it never even made it.

Brad Shreve:
I heard it was gonna be called, Cloverleaf or something of that nature.

Tony Maietta:
No. It was it was Chinatown. It was, the 2 Jakes and Giddis versus Giddis. But I hear there's something happening at Netflix, which might be a prequel to this because this character, JJ Giddis, you know, he's unforgettable. Yeah. And you can understand why people keep returning to this character because you you he is an unforgettable character and an unforgettable He just needs the right story.

Brad Shreve:
And I wanna go back to when I was saying that some of the dialogue is cheesy, and it wouldn't have been done well. This is noir. And today, when they're made, it's very difficult not to make it sound like a farce, and that's really what it came down to for me. It didn't sound like a farce. It's it was so real. It was dead on. Yeah. It it is beautiful.

Tony Maietta:
Well, it's these incredibly gifted actors working at the top of their form Yeah. With an incredibly gifted director Yeah. Working at the top of his form, in this atmosphere of complete creative freedom that Robert Evans created at Paramount at this particular time. You know when they were filming Chinatown, on the soundstage next to them they were filming The Godfather part 2, on the other side of this studio at the soundstage they were filming the Day of the Locust. I mean this is what was happening in this Hollywood, so when I talk about going back to classic Hollywood and I want to see Woman of the Year or the Philadelphia story or the more the merrier, true. But I would take this paramount, I would go back to Paramount and what an incredible era, you know, you know, what brought it down to was drugs too. It was right before all the drugs. I mean, there were drugs, but not like it became.

Tony Maietta:
So Yeah. I mean, that's that's another big downfall of those people. They got a little too happy with the cocaine, and, it it didn't work out well.

Brad Shreve:
I wanna get back to John Houston because I'm always caught off guard when I see him in an acting role because I think, like most people, I think of him as a director, producer, even

Tony Maietta:
one of the greatest,

Brad Shreve:
which I know he did for quite a bit. But so I'm caught off guard when I see him as an actor. And as far as I know, this was his biggest acting role that I can recall.

Tony Maietta:
Definitely. His memory. Definitely. Well, you know, his father was a huge actor. Johnny's, Johnny's father, Walter Houston, was an incredible actor in the in the thirties and forties. And so, you know, Treasure of the Sierra Madre, Dodsworth, and then John specifically went the other direction. He wanted the writing and the acting, oh my God. The African Queen, The Misfits, The Treasure of the Sierra Madre.

Tony Maietta:
I mean these films John Houston is mythic. So near the end of his career, he would make a few cameo appearances. He was in did a cameo in, the a film called The Cardinal. And, I think he also did a a a he was in one of Orson Welles' final films as well. But, you know, this one, I mean, talk about it. If you're gonna act, this is the part to act because, my god, he is perfect as Noah Cross. He is perfect.

Brad Shreve:
And that's what's in my mind because he also did a lot of voice work, I know, and a lot of narrative Mhmm. Narrators and films. And I watch him in this film, and my god. I'm like, why didn't this man act more?

Tony Maietta:
Yeah. You know what? He he preferred writing and directing. He preferred being the boss. You know? Not too hard, not too shabby to figure that out. You know what I mean? It's kind of like, Sydney Pollack. You know? Sydney Pollack was an actor in the beginning of his career, and then he became a director and directed these incredible films such as Tootsie and The Way We Were and Out of Africa. And then near the end of his career, he kinda went back to acting a little bit. He's in Tootsie.

Tony Maietta:
He's in, he played Will Truman's father in Will and Grace. So it's yeah. But when you're the director, you're the boss, you know? So naturally, you're gonna wanna do that. Same thing with Roman Polanski. Roman Polanski also acted. Roman Polanski was in the Fearless Vampire Killers, one of his one of his first films that he made before he came to the United States to make Rosemary's Baby. He has a small part in Chinatown. So you you realize when you're acting, directing, directing, acting, which one you wanna do? Well, you wanna most people wanna do the one where they're calling the shots, and they have the control.

Tony Maietta:
And that was certainly John Houston. But what a what a performance in Chinatown. Incredible. Chilling. Chilling.

Brad Shreve:
Yeah. Just amazing. Before we go, let's, let me give a quick rundown on this film.

Tony Maietta:
Yes. How did this film perform?

Brad Shreve:
This film was made under a $6,000,000 budget, and it earned $29,000,000 to date. I believe that's to date. It still did pretty well in its time, but it was, you know, it was overshadowed in 1974 by the films I listed earlier, Blazing Saddles, Towering Inferno.

Tony Maietta:
Godfather part 2.

Brad Shreve:
It was actually pretty far down the list. I know I think it was 13 it was the 13th highest grossing film in 1974. It is, as I said, 21st in AFI's best 100 films of all time. I think it should be higher, as I think network should be higher.

Tony Maietta:
It is. It is. It's unfortunate. 11 Oscar Even though I forgot it, it's unforgettable. 11 Oscar nominations, one win for Robert Town, incredibly well deserved. You know, in my opinion, you know, so it wasn't a it might not have been a financial blockbuster, but I'm sorry. You are hard pressed to name a film which is greater than Chinatown. Maybe, you know, The Godfather Saga.

Tony Maietta:
Yes. But it's a saga. Okay? Chinatown, one film that did it all. And to this day, as I said, this screenplay is taught in classes and film classes. It's the Torah. People come to this screenplay to learn how to write a screenplay. And I don't I don't think you can you can't give a film more praise than that. I mean, to me, on that Paramount mountain, like I said at the very beginning, it is at the apex.

Tony Maietta:
It's the very apex for me of that mountain.

Brad Shreve:
And as great as Godfather 2, we won't go into number 3. As great as Godfather number 2 were, there were points where it dragged, and this movie never dragged.

Tony Maietta:
Oh, god. No. Ever. You go on a ride in this movie. You're that's another thing I wanted to say too about and the reason you you you're on a ride in this movie is because you are Jake.

Brad Shreve:
Oh, yeah.

Tony Maietta:
If you notice, there is not one scene without Jack Nicholson. And usually Absolutely. Usually, the camera is right behind him. So we are Jack Nicholson. We are finding out everything that's what makes this movie so energizing and so so galvanizing is we're finding out this stuff the same time Jack Nicholson is, and that's what I love about this movie. Not a lot of movies do that. Usually, they like to give things away. No.

Tony Maietta:
We find out exactly the same time that Jack Nicholson does, and that's what gives this movie its energy, its drive. Oh, can't say enough about this film.

Brad Shreve:
And this to me is where it's a mystery novel on the screen because to me, the best mystery novels are written in the first person. Yeah. Because as the reader, you want to get the clues and and understand things as the PI or the sleuth, whoever the sleuth may be, is getting them. And that's what this film you are there. You are Jake.

Tony Maietta:
All those classic Raymond Chandler films are told from the perspective of the Philip Marlowe or the the main character, you know. And so that's that's what's so incredible about this film. It is a film noir from 1974, which I I think is timeless.

Brad Shreve:
And I think this film was screwed when it comes to the Oscars. At least in the Golden Globes, it did get best picture, best acting.

Tony Maietta:
Oh, can we talk for a minute about the score? Oh, that score. Oh, yeah. And it's the second score. It was the second one. They threw out the first one because they didn't it didn't give the effect they wanted. They said it was too disjointed, too jet too too too cacophonous. And so they called Jerry Goldsmith, and he put this score together in, like, 5 days. And this score that that trumpet, to be in Chinatown.

Tony Maietta:
That that the score makes everything. The very first screening of this with the old score did not go well and they realized they needed a new score and Jerry Goldsmith came in and he scored this thing and it is stunning. It's stunning. Everything in this movie is stunning. The acting, the set direction, the costumes by Anthea Silbert, the score, the direction. You can't touch it. You can't touch it. Forget it.

Tony Maietta:
It's Chinatown. So anything else you wanna say about Chinatown?

Brad Shreve:
No. I think I think I've said all I've got. I think this film is okay.

Tony Maietta:
Pretty damn okay. Alright. Well, listen to our playlist. We have some wonderful songs from Chinatown. The score is gorgeous. Listen to it on our Spotify playlist. Please remember to, rate and review us and subscribe. Anything else you wanna say, Brad?

Brad Shreve:
All I have to say, Tony, is let's not say goodbye. Let's just say avoir.

Tony Maietta:
No. Let's say goodbye. Goodbye.

Brad Shreve:
Do you enjoy going to Hollywood? Well, of course, you do. And Tony and I would like you to do something for us and more important for other podcast listeners out there. Go to Apple Podcasts, iTunes, Spotify, or wherever you listen to your podcast and rate and review the show. A 5 star would be especially nice. That way, when others are looking for a new show, they'll see ours and see those reviews, and they will stop and listen. And, boy, that will make their day. It will be much appreciated. Thank you for being with us.